You've probably heard of the "stages of grief" which include denial, anger, bargaining, depression, and acceptance. This model was first described by the influential late psychiatrist Elisabeth Kübler-Ross. A recent article builds on her "stages" model, but likens the grieving process to a pinball machine.

The authors are therapist Margaret Baier, Ph.D., an assistant professor in the family and consumer sciences department at Baylor University, and Ruth Buechsel, a psychologist at Brooke Army medical Center in San Antonio.

In their weekly conversation, WHYY's Behavioral health reporter Maiken Scott and psychologist Dan Gottlieb discuss this idea, and how it might be useful to people who are grieving.